EternalCaves2

[PACO]

[noobX]

question is why ec2 is played anyway
ec is much better/more fun

[Morpheus]

its a map that will eventually stop being played...if you are getting locked in a room without the possibility of return then i guess its a shit map

[Sonic|^]

Lots of wawas. EC2 FTW

[chicken-]

The only way to fix this map is to increase the size of mid by adding a side spawn room in there or something. Add a little more room to fight up top and also a side hallway with spawns or something so at least you're not spawning right in the middle of the path.

[Sunny]

[Carras]

it'd be so fun to post all the suicide-EC2 threads right now.
50% saying make edits
50% saying stfu
100% nothing actually getting fixed

good day

[Steel]

[Junkyardboy]

Everyone complaining about backspawns:


Once upon a time during a prounreal mlig season, ec2 was edited into something I believe called ec3? The backspawns were reduced and everyone spawned high mid/low mid instead of getting those annoying back spawns. What happened to the map flow? every flag that you brought into mid, you would literally have 5 players on the opposing team waiting for the EFC in MID(which would result in a guaranteed flag return). Every offense would spawn in mid, which resulted in retarded pressure on offense, making it impossible to defend the map with only 2 defense properly. It became a cluster fuck of a mess, and it did not flow.

If you get a backspawn and you continually get a back spawn, it's not the map "glitching". It's not luck or random. It's not ec2 playing a mean trick on you to piss you off. It's VERY simple. It's the fact that there are players on the other team occupying the middle area, making it impossible for you to spawn up high/low mid. That's how it works in every single map in ctf. If someone on the opposing team is standing near a spawn point, you will not spawn there, it has nothing to with ec2 being retarded.

In regards to the uneven 1:1.5 spawn ratio, I have seen it go the other way with red having more suicides. You will never get a 1:1 spawn ratio on any given map. I agree that blue does get less back spawns than red when compared in the long run. The advantage you get from getting less back spawns when comparing blue to red is MINIMAL. In both cases, regardless of color, if mid is occupied, no matter if you are blue, red, green or gold, you are not spawning high mid, I repeat, you will not spawn in high mid IF the other team has a player in high mid.

Hopefully that sheds some light.

Map is played competitively. There are sooo many flag returns that happen in not only in mid, but also right on the flag stand, I have no idea what the big commotion is about. I'm surprised no one is complaining about grudge how retarded the map is having a secret room. 95% of the flag runs that end up in high mid = cap.

From my experience, the players who always have an issue with the map are players that a.) don't have a clue what they are doing on offense and get shit stomped by competent back defenders, or even worse, they can't even get past the front defender. b.) players that don't like the tight hallways in low mid, or the tight tunnel to high mid which is sad, because it's what makes the map so exciting in the first place. c.) get owned by whitechoc fallback or d.) After the map is over and they got shit stomped, they follow up by bitching about the spawns as an excuse as to why they lost ec2 when it was really just a b and c.


Siiiick cuuuunt spawn expert,

JYB

[Finalz]

^This

[Carras]

i doubt ec3 received enough actual* playtime before it was thrown to the curb

*by actual I mean good players and more then 10 times played.

it's the same deal with any new map. gets instantly poopoo'd and never played again. maps need time for people to learn spawns, flow, etc before people consider them "good"

[kud]

agreed with jyb, except about grudge.

[InfamousRaider]

[Sauron]

Just because a map is designed a specific way, does not mean it is designed in the optimal way. This is the case with EC2. There are better alternatives than having 8-10 spawns in one spot in a row.

[Junkyardboy]

[Junkyardboy]

[Sauron]

Bleak and Spirit DO need fixed as well. Spydee edited Spirit but I haven't seen it in any pugs.
Bleak could use an alternate high exit (add a narrow ramp going up to the red square pipe thing at high left in the base and chop off some of the wall (make a window of sorts) to the left of it to help defenders see/shoot people using that ramp and you will have a more balanced map instantly).

[Morpheus]

spirit only needs bouncers fixed...its always a high cap map when it comes to pugs or even league games...

[Finalz]

spirit's kickers need to get fixed, and please do not touch bleak its fine as it is.

[tigerclaw1987]

Backroom spawns also give D an advantage, since you have a chance to spawn behind and prevent the flag/fc from getting past the flag stand

In truth you always get 2-3 attempts to break down and stop an attack before it gets to the fc being in mid and you spawning behind base

If you can't handle that, then your opponent played better(were luckier, which is a skill too;<) or your D played badly and shouldn't complain

Having more spawns in mid or flag room promotes DMing and from what people are asking for makes it EASIER to D a map that's already easy to D on?

Get it together bro

[Sunny]

WHERES WHITE[CHOC]... WHY IS HE NOT DEFENDING OUR BELOVED MAP

[chicken-]

I think the problem here is that spawning in perfect EFC cutoff spots is lame one way where spawning way in the back can be lame the other, but tiger has a good point regarding the fact that you should have already had 1-2 good attempts at killing the EFC before he left your base even if you did spawn back there, at that point you just didn't kill him in time and he's gone. But the randomness of spawning right in front of the EFC in mid just makes the whole thing kind of ridiculous IMO.

As I sort of said before, I just don't think there's a solution to satisfy the complaints without adding additional areas or rooms to the map somewhere for spawns, maybe expanding the high mid area somehow. You can move them wherever but it's still going to be right in the middle of the only 2 ways out of the base.

Does anybody know why the GU version won't load up in my unrealed? I'd be willing to take a butt-crack at it knowing full well whatever I do probably won't be a solution that anybody will accept but I'll mess with it when I'm bored Does the GU version have any necessary edits besides the spawns being changed?

[kud]

nob (who probably made the changes) usually deletes the bsp framework, or vertices, or whatever the geometry is called. it reduces map size, but it does make it a pain in the ass to edit maps. maybe he has the complete version around.

[chicken-]

Really not necessary for a 1.5MB map

[Adventure Club]

Better solution: Delete duku