1v1 NN tourny????

[Sonic|^]

ONE day tournament ala KOTR. Using NewNet. 16 players max (10 imo). Single elimination. Who's interested?

1)Sonic|^
2)aNty
3)Kud
4)Angus

[aNty]

hin

[kud]

[Sauron]

1v1 NN is a very broad description. 1v1 CTF? 1v1 DM? Maps?

[Sonic|^]

[Sauron]

Where exactly did I assume it would be CTF? Anyway, more immediate information is better in order to gain a rough idea of how many people to expect. Would it be 15 minutes a map? Best of 3? Or would each map be a frag limit of 15 or something? These factors influence whether or not a person would be interested in participating.

[Sonic|^]

I forgot where I was for a second. None of you guys really play 1v1s.

Rules normally are.

Best of 3
Single Elimination
15 minutes
Newnet
Shieldbelt
No Amp
No Invisibility
Weapon stay off

[Sauron]

You mean no shieldbelt right? lol
I'd probably participate even though I don't like 1v1 at all.

[Sonic|^]

[Sauron]

What's the point of shieldbelt in IG? 2 hits or something? Seems dumb tbh.

[PACO]

[RickJames]

I tested the latest version of newnet in a TDM pug yesterday, and hitscan weaps (sniper, shock, mini, enforcer) are still overpowered. The problem with this in 1v1 is that it makes map control (the central aspect of 1v1) less important. The newnet 1v1s I played were basically sniper arena, and it was impossible to hold a map lock when me and my opponent were constantly headshotting/primaring each other. For these reasons, I'd prefer a reg weapons 1v1 tourney or a NN IG 1v1 tourney.

Also, I'd recommend expanding the map list: Turbine and DavidM (not DavidM2, which is more spawnkilling-based) are both good 1v1 maps that are played in CB 1v1 cups. Tempest is an old school 1v1 map that could work, as well (big map that plays kind of like phobos). There are also some more unorthodox maps you could add in that have potential, such as Amon (test it out, it's on the #tdmpickups servers).

[PACO]

@Sonic, hit me with a pm tomorrow. I have a few ideas for this.

[Sauron]

oh, weapons, i see. I would definitely participate then.

[dR3]

[Sauron]

Wouldn't hitscan weapons being stronger make controlling those weapons (map control) even more important?

[Sonic|^]

[TimTim]

RJ's confirmation bias is showing again. I was in the TDM pug and I distinctly remember RJ pretty much only ever using hitscan, probably because he'd already made up his mind before the pug (before ever even trying the latest version) that hitscan is overpowered. I actually don't recall ever personally seeing him use projectiles although he did mention switching from flak to sniper in irc, saying the switch was too fast (which it may have been, in the form of a lingering weapon switch bug).

So with that said, I probably made more kills with projectile weapons on Seraphim (a pretty hitscan heavy map) than any other weapon. Hell, I even killed Sunny with the ripper of all weapons multiple times while he was trying to chase me down using hitscan. If that's not proof that newnet is balanced, I don't know what is.

Furthermore, UT was always dominated by hitscan. Why do you think all the top players (sorn, bleh, etc.) are known for their aim? Why do you think controlling sniper has always been an integral part of gameplay? The difference now with newnet isn't that suddenly sniper/hitscan is more dominant than before, it's that everyone regardless of ping is able to use it properly.

The playing field is even. And the weapons are balanced. Any smart player with good positioning and good movement can use projectiles to take out someone using hitscan. Here's one more example: a few weeks ago I played unrealshots 1v1 newnet weapons. Yes, his aim is much better than mine. And no, he doesn't play weapons so he isn't very good at it. We played deck twice, and keep in mind that this was actually the first time I'd played weapons in a couple of months so I was pretty rusty. I didn't use much hitscan while he used it the entire time, hitting me anytime I was in view and headshotting me left and right, and yet he lost pretty badly both times. (I mean no offense if you're reading this shots!) So the argument that newnet throws things off balance is 100% unfounded.

[InfamousRaider]

This post was deleted by Sonic|^ on Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:17 pm.

[Morpheus]

I'd go for this if it mainly constitutes in IG players playing it...if it involves l33t players from nw i pass lol no fun in getting totally smashed in tha face ... unless there are 2 divisions

[HuMPtY]

sounds good newnet1v1 tourny would be alot of fun.
if rj wants to quit before it starts this time thats fine.

wanted to do a ig 1v1 tourny in the new year too, prob as a warmup to kotr .. plenty of stuff to do with idom sdom 1v1 tourneys

[TimTim]

[Sunny]

sniper and shock are the most over powered weapons in the game... news to any1? lol... anyways i'd be down for a 1v1 nn tournament hopefully its soon within the next couple of weeks?

[RickJames]

Tim et al: I don't think I conveyed what I meant by "overpowered" well. Of course shock and sniper have always been the dominant weaps in UT- I have no problem with that at all. I'm a huge shock and sniper whore myself- What you saw in the pug was my normal play style. The main problem is that it's simply too easy to hit with enforcer, mini, shock, and sniper in newnet. Any scrub (such as myself) can hit all day with those weaps in newnet, and it affects the weapon balance considerably.

For example, if I spawn next to a stacked enemy who's holding a rocket launcher, my only option is to pull Micheal Jackson moves around them and try to get as many enforcer shots off as I can until I die. In reg, I would normally get 2 or 3 shots off vs. a good player before they were able to kill me. In newnet, I was dancing around detox when he had belt and was able to take off his whole stack with 5+ shots before I died. The weapon wasn't shooting any faster, and detox didn't have much trouble killing me- It's just that my enforcer felt like it couldn't miss.

Your examples of being able to use projectile weaps vs hitscan players don't say much. I would hope that you'd still be able to kill someone using sniper at close range with ripper/rockets/flak etc. I'd also hope that you'd be able to beat a hitscan player who has no 1v1 experience (like unrealshots) in 1v1. If you couldn't do either of those things, that would be ridiculous. I probably exaggerated when I called it "sniper arena". Hitscan weaps are still useful in certain situations ofc, but the balance is thrown off enough to make map control (the central aspect of 1v1) significantly less important than usual.

You mentioned sorn and bleh- sorn's amazing hitscan helps make him one of the best players in weapons tdm and ctf. In 1v1, though, he's mediocre at best compared to players like sLY and dasNaksta (no offense sorn), because his map control abilities (a very general term which includes prediction, ability to sync powerup times in circuits, etc) are much weaker than theirs. bleh plays on American servers with 130 ping, where his hitscan is much weaker than on euro servers, and he is still a top player. He's a master of map control and pretty much every aspect of 1v1.

With that said, I think newnet is great for matches between players with high ping. It's just no substitute for the map control aspect of reg 1v1 between players with low ping. Sorry for the long post, but I'd feel bad if I didn't clarify myself